tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post4519332328020977404..comments2024-03-21T23:18:45.644+00:00Comments on Priest with a Cause - A World of Warcraft (Classic) blog: State of the dungeon finderShintarhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16758343475446510635noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-62495012949561441382011-01-13T12:52:31.122+00:002011-01-13T12:52:31.122+00:00@Liore: But I said that the puggers I've met i...@Liore: But I said that the puggers I've met in heroics have been good! It's the normals you have to worry about really.<br /><br />@Anonymous after Lara: Your "whose fault is it anyway" checklist is interesting, but I've found that it tends to be more complex than that these days. For example I've seen a lot of dps die to what I consider the tank's fault, because he charges in, insisting to tank everything at once and taking so much damage that he can barely be kept up even with non-stop heal spammage, and the poor dps then die from some unavoidable AoE because I literally can't spare even a second to put a HoT on them or something.<br /><br />@Yet another Anonymous: No, that's the thing, mages do <i>not</i> have any talents that benefit from spirit anymore, check the talent trees. Even abilities that used to scale with spirit, such as mage armor have had the spirit component removed. It really does nothing at all for them.<br /><br />@Next Anonymous: I can only agree. I go through more drinks in normals than in heroics because the tanks insist on just tanking everything even if they can't really take it.Shintarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16758343475446510635noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-59976760624905653162011-01-12T08:50:20.922+00:002011-01-12T08:50:20.922+00:00@Brian: Less than 5 minutes. Same for tanks. The g...@Brian: Less than 5 minutes. Same for tanks. The group stays at the top of the queue and, at least for heroics, I've never had to wait long to get a replacement anything.<br /><br />(Which, as an aside, is why I can't understand tanks who drop at the beginning of a dungeon. They get a 30 minutes debuff, we get a new tank in 5...)Jenhttp://www.storiesofwow.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-87308670818556993802011-01-11T17:43:08.369+00:002011-01-11T17:43:08.369+00:00Thanks for the read.
I play a druid, currently r...Thanks for the read. <br /><br />I play a druid, currently restro. Frankly, if I don't like the group I give them a warning. Hopefully things change else I leave. It takes almost no time for me to find another instance, while I have no idea how long they wait on a replacement healer (who they are likely going to piss off too).<br /><br />I am going to start gearing up my tanking gear and I suspect it will even be easier to replace crappy players.Briannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-79032665921379151332011-01-11T13:50:58.899+00:002011-01-11T13:50:58.899+00:00I was pleasantly surprised by most of my pugs so f...I was pleasantly surprised by most of my pugs so far. I first started pugging because I was angry and didn't want to inflict myself on guildies and/or didn't want to run with certain guildies who get on my nerves. The pugs ended up being more fun than the guild groups, for the most part. Unlike someone up there ^, 99% of my "guild pugs" (4 people from a guild + me) have been very pleasant - including a Grim Batol run with only one wipe! (I loathe and fear that place.)<br /><br />We're 1 month into Cataclysm and people have probably started to get used to the new style. Normals are still hit and miss because some tanks think they can just run in and facepull, but I haven't seen one "gogogo"er in heroics yet. (Luckily for me, my druid main isn't doing normals anymore, and my shammy alt can just Hex/Bind the mobs eating her face.)Jenhttp://www.storiesofwow.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-28131477535450844192011-01-11T11:54:31.165+00:002011-01-11T11:54:31.165+00:00Normal dungeons, interestingly, have been more cha...Normal dungeons, interestingly, have been more challenging because most tanks face pull every group. I'll speak up and suggest CC because we have it and can use it and get a reply like "how about we just keep going." These tend to be paladin tanks but I would say I get paladin tanks 99% of the time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-38523656229318454752011-01-11T11:45:48.093+00:002011-01-11T11:45:48.093+00:00You know, some mages have talents that allow a cer...You know, some mages have talents that allow a certain percentage of passive mana regen to continue while casting, and if they run out of mana they aren't doing dps, so spirit is still a dps stat insofar as it allows them to continue dpsing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-27359839155557270842011-01-11T09:20:51.814+00:002011-01-11T09:20:51.814+00:00@L +spirit gear is for all hybrid dps/healers. Hyb...@L +spirit gear is for all hybrid dps/healers. Hybrid healer dps classes (ie moonkins, elemental shamans and shadow priests) get 1 to 1 spirit to hit conversion. It's designed so they don't have to create a separate set of healer and dps caster mail and leather gear. It's also given to shadow priests, despite them having access also to mage/lock gear, because otherwise, spirit cloth will be niche cloth for priest healer only. (Atm, only holy paladins have niche gear like this).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-57488687988669985012011-01-11T09:17:50.138+00:002011-01-11T09:17:50.138+00:00Yes, I have problems accepting puggers needing on ...Yes, I have problems accepting puggers needing on the wrong gear as well. Mages/locks on spirit gear is a common one. Another is DKs on agility loot. I was so glad the time a one-hand axe dropped and my guildie enhance shaman won the roll over a DK dps. I really don't get why people who are obviously not suited for the gear can roll need on them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-90831837768664979612011-01-11T06:15:34.264+00:002011-01-11T06:15:34.264+00:00Nice post.
I play a Resto Shaman and as that most...Nice post.<br /><br />I play a Resto Shaman and as that mostly have had no trouble rolling for gear that I needed. Unlessa another shaman was in the group. Otherwise gearing is going pretty well.<br /><br />Mana has been a serious issue as of late. Just got to 85 and ran my first Grim Batol run and it was kind of a nightmare with the tank being a bit faster than my mana regen or my reaction in general. And he didn't really let me finish my drink at times. A few times a DPS died but other than that we got through it kidna ok. Mana is a bit too hard to manage at the moment, in my opinion. I hate being the only one who sits down after every fight to get some mana. I know it's supposed to be harder but not next to impossible. One interrupted cast can mean the difference between a succesful run and a wipe and that I think is a bit too sensitive. I know the tanks have large health pools but when damage comes in as spiky as it did in some Wrath instances it's no fun. I'm constantly casting Healing Wave because it's cheap enough to keep it on constant cast. If I have to fit in a few Greater Healing Wave I will see my mana pool drop too rapidly.<br /><br />Once I got to the poing where I did ragequit as a healer. Just finished a trash group, told the tank I needed mana (was at 4k/57k), tank ignored and charged (yes it was a warrior) and I ha just sat down to drink so I quit. I'm not paying for repair bills if I have called a break.<br /><br />Anyway it's been a fun and challenging expasion but once DPS re-learn CC it will be golden.Sanitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-64868101586524061242011-01-11T04:47:03.481+00:002011-01-11T04:47:03.481+00:00@Beckett: I think the theory is supposed to be tha...@Beckett: I think the theory is supposed to be that +spirit gear is for healers, +hit gear is for dps, and gear with neither stat on it is fair game to both. That said, I've run into both healers and dps who seem to think that haste/crit or crit/mastery or whatever kind of non-spirit/hit item they want is only for their role. I've had casters gquit because a healer won a haste/crit cloak, for example.<br /><br />I guess think of it as a Venn diagram, with a circle for pure healing gear, and a circle for pure dps gear, and the overlap being gear that has neither spirit nor hit on it.L.https://www.blogger.com/profile/07967574375231592384noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-60694551086758142612011-01-11T03:55:40.715+00:002011-01-11T03:55:40.715+00:00From recount link the "damage taken" met...From recount link the "damage taken" meter. If the DPS are above the tank then let them know. Also link the interupts meter, it it's empty then let them know.<br /><br />Healing is only a problem when DPS don't do their jobs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-3195313572185720642011-01-11T02:23:31.973+00:002011-01-11T02:23:31.973+00:00My main's a feral but I also have a priest and...My main's a feral but I also have a priest and a lock, and maybe it's because of the priest and how much she needs the spirit on the healy gear but I would never ever roll against a healer on spirit items on my lock. In fact, I'm doing everything I can to avoid spirit on her gear - she doesn't need mana regen (hello) and only 40% of spirit can be reforged to hit or some other useful stat.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00277930643027557008noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-52142908834071176192011-01-11T02:03:59.718+00:002011-01-11T02:03:59.718+00:00I'm a bear tank. My wife is my main healer. ...I'm a bear tank. My wife is my main healer. I've been playing since vanilla my wife since wrath, with a switch to tanking in wrath. My biggest issue with pugging is that I don't need JP, just the rep to finish my grinds. So as such, I don't need the agro I get from "Go Go Go" dps. I don't have the ranged tools of a DK or Pally so a lot of my pulls are either CC or LoS.<br />If you're hesitant of pugging there are a couple of things you can do at the start of an instance:<br />1. Say it's your first time in the instance (regardless of whether it is) and that you are fairly new to healing.<br />2. Let DPS die when they're continually tanking stuff they shouldn't be (I do this as a tank, my excuses will be either "somebody broke it" or "taunt was on cooldown" or "follow my target"). Healers have it better, they can just not heal somebody<br />3. If the tank is not behaving rationally (as described by the OP) then slow down the instance, take your time moving to fights/drinking, insist on marks, call out CC breaks etc.<br />Effectively, if the pulls are marked, CC is done and the group follows their roles then healing in heroics should not be stressful. If the tank is squishy (low mitigation/avoidance) then you won't have the mana to save DPS. Aside from some boss mechanics which make it hard to succeed with low DPS there are no enrage timers. Sacrificing one thoughtless (or careless) DPS to the volcano gods a few times can often make a big difference.<br />The following is my checklist for deaths:<br />1. Healer dead. Tanks fault.<br />2. Healer OOM, tank dead. DPS fault<br />3. DPS dead, DPS fault<br />4. Tank dead to missed interupt, DPS fault<br />5. Tank dead due to standing on volcanos, tank fault<br />6. Tank dead, healer full mana & bad CC, DPS fault<br />7. Tank dead, healer full mana & good CC/positioning then it's healer's fault<br />For info, I am geared enough so that in heroics that I'm now getting rage starved. Getting kicked from heroics when you're doing the right things may be disheartening, but at least you're not playing with idiots then.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-62152221367648195652011-01-11T00:48:30.130+00:002011-01-11T00:48:30.130+00:00Anonymous- that's not quite true. For rare or ...Anonymous- that's not quite true. For rare or epic dungeon drops you CAN trade cross-server, just not for regular things- like water, gold, greens, etc.Larahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18081539940848147296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-9306624183854643202011-01-11T00:21:24.118+00:002011-01-11T00:21:24.118+00:00The boss in Heroic BRC with the flame pillar is a ...The boss in Heroic BRC with the flame pillar is a tank intensive fight. Basically a good tank can make that boss easy, but a bad tank can make it disastrous. Good tank keeps stacks low, doesn't allow adds to spawn, and saves defensive cd's for the end when boss is doing the most damage. If you wiped multiple times despite your best healing effort, then your tank was probably not doing these things.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-61801997535468107532011-01-10T23:48:50.397+00:002011-01-10T23:48:50.397+00:00I'm finding it shocking and disheartening that...I'm finding it shocking and disheartening that I've been kicked from groups a few times. I am a resto druid and in Wrath my guild was in the top four on our server, and I was one of our top healers, or at least the most available tree. I've got experience in healing.<br />Though I took a long hiatus before Cata and I'm feeling like I'm no spring chicken anymore. I'm no longer raiding but I have good enough gear for heroics, and I understand my new mechanics. It COULD be me, but I'm not sure.<br />I know in one instance when the tank flat out refused CC despite my politest request threw a hissy fit and kicked me when we wiped on HoO trash. Totally not my fault I know now, that trash is certainly not meant to be zerged. Though I am AMAZED the DPS allowed this to happen too. Didn't any of THEM have sense or did they just assume the tank is always right?<br />Had a few wipes in Heroic Blackrock Caverns too before I was wordlessly ejected. I don't know if I just couldn't heal through the boss damage (The one with the flame pillar) or if there was avoidable damage being taken. I gave it everything I had though, and I can't take my eyes off the health meters long enough to check if everyone else is also giving it their all.Oaknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-48354616839840018932011-01-10T23:31:20.028+00:002011-01-10T23:31:20.028+00:00Ooh, I've been terrified to PUG (probably on m...Ooh, I've been terrified to PUG (probably on my DPS alt, which I'm not super pro at playing) heroics because I am one of those silly people who gets unduly upset when called names by strangers on the internet. <br /><br />I don't think this post helped! :)Liorehttp://www.machiavelliscat.com/lioreblog/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-31367728329731604882011-01-10T23:17:24.356+00:002011-01-10T23:17:24.356+00:00Ooh, link love from Tam brings a lot of comments.
...Ooh, link love from Tam brings a lot of comments.<br /><br />@musicchan: "Still, I suffer guilt. Too bad other people don't." That's a great quote and pretty much sums up my feelings during such runs. Sometimes I think I should just start ninjaing dps gear in return, but it wouldn't make me feel better, only guilty.<br /><br />@Nyska: That actually dropped for me in heroic Grim Batol today and I was able to need on it.<br /><br />@Backett: Well, personally I don't have that double standard because I don't need on gear that doesn't have spirit on it. I might not need to have that stat on absolutely every item, but Blizzard made enough drops to make it possible, so why would I want to take gear that was clearly designed with other classes in mind?<br /><br />@Anonymous: Being the odd one out in what's otherwise a full guild run can be a blessing or a curse. On the one hand it could be as you say and they just ignore you, but on the other hand the group is likely to have some stability even if things go wrong and if it's a nice guild then you might actually be in for a treat (like in your orb example).<br /><br />@Next Anonymous: Actually the main thing I blamed the mage in that example for is that after losing the roll he then had the guts to complain about it as well.<br /><br />@Anonymous after Tuebor: I figured that tanks were probably going to be the most understanding of this particular dilemma. Though to me a lock rolling on spirit gear is actually even worse than needing for off-spec, since he doesn't <i>have</i> an off-spec that would use the stat. The equivalent for tanking gear would be a dps needing on dodge/parry loot just because it also happened to have strength on it.<br /><br />@Last Anonymous: Are you sure about that? I'm pretty sure I traded some loot cross-server only a few weeks ago. I don't see why they would have disabled that.Shintarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16758343475446510635noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-48669166336622337572011-01-10T21:50:24.176+00:002011-01-10T21:50:24.176+00:00Just a quick one.
In a LFD group, unless you are f...Just a quick one.<br />In a LFD group, unless you are from the same server, you cant trade items. So, even if you had wanted to swap drops with the warlock, you wouldn't have been able toAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-4752594853954381132011-01-10T21:34:44.775+00:002011-01-10T21:34:44.775+00:00My first experiences pugging Heroics were great. ...My first experiences pugging Heroics were great. Everyone was learning the dungeons, and the increased difficulty of fights together. Very rarely did I run into a player with a bad attitude or impatience at wiping. Sadly, in the last couple weeks that seems to be changing. Now that a lot of people have higher gear levels, and know the fights better, the impatience has grown exponentially. There seems to be one or two "experts" every run now that get great joy in bossing everyone around, and then raging when someone doesn't do something right. Also the willingness to CC and other efficient practices is lowering as well. Too bad....<br /><br />As a Pally tank, I never roll need on an item that has off stats for my spec. In my opinion if you want something for an off-spec, or that doesn't quite fit your role, you should wait to make sure no one else needs it first. DK's have been the worst for me... At least 3-4 times a DPS queue'd DK has out rolled me on something that has Dodge or Parry on it. Their explanation... My off spec is tanking. Great. Then queue as a tank if you want tanking gear. Either that or defer to the actual tank who is running you through the dungeon.<br /><br />So frustrating...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-83176118681923365292011-01-10T21:07:22.031+00:002011-01-10T21:07:22.031+00:00Learning boss mechanics and CC are the two major p...Learning boss mechanics and CC are the two major problems I faced for Heroic PuGs.<br /><br />Here is a guide on CCing: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/820741-The-complete-crowd-control-Guide.<br /><br />I rarely have an issue with a DPS not doing enough DPS. There were two rare cases where I had someone only outputting 4k DPS. 5-6k DPS seems average for most PuG DPSers. The somewhat geared ones do 8k+.Tuebornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-1457017436025277902011-01-10T20:08:10.227+00:002011-01-10T20:08:10.227+00:00I've had perfectly acceptable experiences in n...I've had perfectly acceptable experiences in normals thus far. Worst was getting kicked with no warning/no explanation (My theory: to make room for a guildy)<br /><br />My wife keeps telling me that the tanks are starting to get big head though. She plays a DPS warrior and had one tank tell her she "should have rolled tank if she wanted to get loot." <br /><br />We did have one group where the tank demanded we kick him from a run of Halls of Origination because we didn't know the dungeon and he couldn't be deigned to explain anything.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-294784366555956532011-01-10T19:55:06.601+00:002011-01-10T19:55:06.601+00:00If you're in BRC, and you're a level 80 ma...If you're in BRC, and you're a level 80 mage who just leveled to 80 right before Cataclysm and is wearing an ilvl 174 ring, why wouldn't that mage roll on "spirit gear" that is going to be a HUGE upgrade in terms of intellect and stamina? Blame the system (letting classes roll on gear that isn't optimized for their class), not the mage.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-4719210049992544722011-01-10T19:53:56.623+00:002011-01-10T19:53:56.623+00:00Solid post -- great to see other ppl's experie...Solid post -- great to see other ppl's experience in LFD. I'm new to my guild (started right after Cata went live) and I play later at night than most of my guildies, so as a non-hybrid DPS I almost invariably have to sit through a nightly queue of 30-40 minutes. I like PUGs, too, but with that lengthy wait I do have a vested interest in landing with a good group, and without guildies I'm just taking a chance each time.<br /><br />Happily I can report that most of my heroic runs have been fine, usually thanks to an awesome tank. I got H-SFK as my first heroic and I had never seen a tank do so many LoS pulls (Yes, I am a wrath baby, or at least a warmed-over BC toddler). With his knowledge and command ability ("melee stand here, ranged come with me, etc.") we didn't wipe once. A thing of beauty.<br /><br />On the other hand, because I run late at night (for my server time -- the Oceanic people are fully awake), I've seen more than my fair share of tanks just abruptly announcing "going to bed, see ya" and then leaving. Requeueing in those circumstances is painfully boring, and nothing is worse than sticking it out only to find a new tank zone into Stonecore, take one look around, then hightail it out again. (Usually the group falls apart at this point.)<br /><br />I've also run into tanks who won't mark or who tell me "CC whatever you want, idc" and then break my CC with AoE. DPS mostly seem to understand that this isn't Wrath anymore, and healers also know that things have changed. In our guild we have a shortage of tanks and people are being asked to offspec tank, so I try to be tolerant of bad tanking since I know many people are still learning. But not knowing CC etiquette after a month+ of Cata is fail, imho.<br /><br />My other worst runs have come when I'm the odd man out in a 4-man guild run, which has happened to me 2-3 times now. Those groups basically don't seem to care about the random pugger (to be fair, it's sorta hard to blame them, lol) and if they've done the instance before, they usually don't seem to want to explain it. I'll say "never done this boss on H, what should I do?" and I'll get a canned response like "kill adds, stay out of fire" as the tank runs in to pull. Thanks guys, I never thought of that. <br /><br />As to loot, I am happy to report I've had no loot contention issues. As melee DPS I don't seem to have too many people trying to ninja my shinies. Most PUGers are happy for me when I win something. With everyone gearing up still, it's often a parade of "grats" after each boss.<br /><br />Let me make one last comment about 4-man guild runs + 1 PUGer, the type that I disparaged above: after my last run with a group like this, the [chaos orb] dropped, and I mentioned I was desperate for it and would offer to buy it. At that point everyone else passed on it except for one guy who'd already rolled. I won the roll anyway (hallelujah! engineering helm, you were mine to craft at last!) but the group said they'd have passed it to me anyway since I needed it. They said that since they usually did guild runs, all their crafters were doing fine on orbs anyway. So my advice: when you're the odd-man out, don't be shy about speaking up, as the group may be willing to help you as this group was for me. There's no way all these people would have passed on a chaos orb in a truly random group, at least not this early in the expansion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4659326122793396570.post-3388070568997496802011-01-10T19:44:52.249+00:002011-01-10T19:44:52.249+00:00I have noticed a bit of a double standard on the l...I have noticed a bit of a double standard on the loot thing though. As a warlock, I would never roll need on a spirit item anymore, because those are healer items. Fair, if I rolled need on that stuff I should be bitched at. But then when healers roll on non-spirit stuff, they seem to think that's pretty okay. Talking about actual armor gear here, not trinkets that work for both. So more or less what we the casters are being told is "Healers get to roll on twice as much stuff as you, get over it".Beckettnoreply@blogger.com