07/01/2022

All Heroics Completed!

One of my vague goals for Classic Burning Crusade was to play through all the heroic dungeons again, even the unpopular ones. I'm something like 99% sure that I did them all back in the day as well, but I have no clear recollection or record of it, so I wanted to do it all again to refresh my memory. Last week I managed to complete this goal by finally being able to tick heroic Mana Tombs off the list, the last heroic I had yet to complete in Classic. (Not counting Magister's Terrace, which won't be out for a while yet.)

With that done, I wanted to write down some thoughts on each heroic.

Hellfire Citadel

Hellfire Ramparts

This is a very easy heroic and I kind of wonder why people don't do it for badges more often, considering that it's quite short as well. I mean, there are some trash pulls that are a bit tricky to get right, but I wouldn't expect that to be a huge issue? I can only guess that the lack of other incentives is the reason why it isn't more popular (no regular quests send you there and none of the loot seems particularly exciting).

The Blood Furnace

This one seems to be an unpopular one, seemingly based on many people having bad experiences with it early in the expansion and then being like "never again". For me however, it was the heroic that kicked off our little dungeon troupe running things just for fun and I'll always remember it fondly for that.

Standing at attention to hear our fearless leader's plan.

We've run it a few more times since then and it's always been a blast. Most of it isn't too hard anyway; it's just that cage event before the second boss that's challenging, but if you're there with friends even that's a good thing in my eyes, because it's challenging in a way that encourages you to make a plan and stick to it, and if everyone executes their part correctly, nobody dies and you all get to feel good about yourselves at the end of it. The felguards just before the last boss occasionally one-shotting dps players is just a bit of extra comedy.

The Shattered Halls

This is probably the most hated heroic that people still run anyway, mostly because both the quest for the Nightbane urn and the Tempest Keep attunement (now not needed anymore, but still gives a title) require you to come here. And to be fair, I kind of get it. It's a bunch of straight hallways full of trash in a way that makes it impossible to skip anything except some of those gladiators near the end, and there are many pulls that are just too big for a non-paladin tank to effectively hold aggro on. Doesn't matter how geared they are or whether they're the best player in the world, Swipe only hits three targets and Thunder Clap up to four - if there are more enemies than that and you can't CC them, you need to hit them individually and that just takes time that you might not have before they decide to go after the healer.

I've only tanked it on normal myself and on some pulls the mobs were definitely all over the place - it's just that on normal this won't wipe you. My heroic runs with non-paladin tanks have always involved a lot of frantic running around and I can't blame any tank for finding it stressful that one missed attack at the wrong moment might result in a dps - or worse, the healer - getting one-shot. Basically you need a team where everyone really works together and is willing to take some responsibility by using cooldowns, slows etc. on almost every pull and that's just a lot to ask. That said, as a non-tank I really don't mind it.

Coilfang Reservoir

The Slave Pens

Easily the most popular heroic by a mile. It's relatively easy and therefore pretty beginner-friendly, but that doesn't explain why people prefer it quite so much over e.g. Ramparts which is very similar in that regard. My guess is that it's got something to do with the SSC attunement quest requiring at least two visits of the dungeon (once to pick up the quest and then a second time to hand it in) and the last boss actually dropping some pretty good loot, not least a trinket that's pre-raid best in slot for many casters. Also, you can skip huge amounts of trash and I get the impression that people enjoy being able to do that even if it doesn't reduce the duration of the dungeon significantly when compared to other short instances.

Three frost mages and their pets is almost like having six damage dealers... who aren't very good.

The Underbog

If Shattered Halls is the most hated heroic that people do anyway, this is probably the easiest heroic that nobody ever does. Nothing except the timing of some trash pulls near the end is really hard and there's a lot of skinning and herbing to be done for those with either gathering skill. However, like Ramparts it has no quests telling you to go there while also being somewhat longer than the latter, so I guess that's why people rarely bother.

The Steamvault 

This is another fairly popular destination as you can skip a lot of trash and what remains is on a similar level to Slave Pens. The bosses are perhaps slightly tougher, especially the first one, but it's nothing too dramatic.

Auchindoun

Mana Tombs

Nobody ever wants to go to Mana Tombs, which is why it was the last heroic I got to check off my list, and it took a lot of convincing to get enough of my friends and guildies to go along with it. The common refrain seemed to be that the first boss required shadow resistance gear on the tank, which I didn't remember being an issue back in the day so I handwaved it away.

Now, strictly speaking I was correct as we did kill him without resist gear, but we were fairly well geared and we still wiped about half a dozen times before getting him down, mostly as everybody needed to learn to be disciplined with stopping dps whenever the damage reflection shield went up as otherwise people would just kill themselves within the blink of an eye. I was healing on that run and I also just barely managed to keep the tank alive with non-stop Holy Light spam and with the boss dying just in time for me to be completely OOM.

The other two bosses were a relative cakewalk after that, even the last one with the add summons that I recalled being somewhat of a pain back in the day.

"Successfully healed through heroic Mana Tombs" flex.

Auchenai Crypts

There are some good drops for several physical dps classes in this one, plus a valuable enchanting recipe drops from the trash as well. Combine that with how short it is (having only two bosses), which makes it a quick four badges on days when it's the daily heroic, and I'd say this is a reasonably popular heroic. Not a favourite, but people do run it with decent frequency.

Sethekk Halls

Sethekk Halls can be pretty rough on heroic, with a lot of trash for a place that only has two bosses by default, and with many mobs having some pretty disruptive abilities, from knockbacks and mind-control totems to silences and fears. Both bosses are pretty tough on the healer as well - but there are two powerful incentives to go anyway: It's the other heroic needed to acquire the urn to summon Nightbane, and every druid who wants to get epic flight form needs to complete it at least once as well. The latter also involves summoning the bonus boss Anzu, who can drop himself as a super rare mount, which is something that always holds a certain appeal.

Shadow Labyrinth 

This is another one that's not very popular but people do it anyway, if only for the Tempest Keep attunement/Champion of the Naaru title. Reasons to dislike it are that it's on the long side and that there's a lot of unskippable trash, and like in Shattered Halls there are some huge pulls. While these are at least limited to the second boss's room, they are in some way even worse than Shattered Halls because even a well-geared paladin tank can't just AoE tank it all due to the enemy shadow priest mobs just melting people in seconds if uncontrolled. I remember on my first run of this, our dps group consisted of a hunter (me), a shadow priest and a dps warrior and we both wiped a lot and had to get quite creative with our crowd control plans in the end. That said, I do like a challenge.

Caverns of Time

Old Hillsbrad Foothills

This was the penultimate heroic I struggled to complete before Mana Tombs, also because hardly anyone ever wants to run it. The first time I heard someone talk about it, they said something like this (I'm paraphrasing a bit): "Heroic Old Hillsbrad? We tried that once, but the adds before the last boss kept one-shotting our tank. And we were already raid-geared at that point! Never again."

Still, for me tales of how impossible a dungeon is only serve to spur me on to want to see for myself - I guess because I always assume that people must have been doing it wrong and that I can do better (conceited, I know...) and in the end I ended up running it twice within a week or so, once on my hunter and once on my mage.

The first run with my hunter was quite a memorable adventure with a lot of mishaps along the way, though we interestingly managed to one-shot the encounter with the last boss. It sure was a fight to remember though... our tank did indeed also die on the second wave of adds, but we kept muddling through by using CC to the best of our ability, letting Thrall off-tank and so on. There is a short break before the boss himself engages, during which we could get the tank resed and healed up to start the main fight at full strength - and things did seem to go okay for a bit, until suddenly everyone was dead and I was the last person standing. "Feign death and let him tank!" yelled my levelling buddy over voice (referring to Thrall), which I did and which subsequently allowed me to finish off the boss. He did manage to put a deadly DoT on me just before dying, which I only just out-healed by immediately sitting down as soon as combat ended and stuffing my face with mage food. What a fight though!

I only remembered to take a screenshot of the carnage after I'd survived the DoT.

On the second run we did better during the first half of the instance but then wiped on the last encounter half a dozen times due to the adds always killing our tank, the healer, or both, but eventually we got it down as well.

The Black Morass

The Black Morass is another not very popular destination, but in a different way than places like Shattered Halls or Shadow Labs. There are a couple of good loot drops here that incentivise tanks and physical dps to return, and it's probably the easiest heroic to tank, seeing how all you need to do is pick up the big mob by each portal and try to cleave the adds to some extent.

The problem is that the dps requirements for a smooth run are very high, and it's very easy for a mistake to spiral out of control, at which point it's most likely a wipe and due to the timed nature of the instance the whole run's probably a bust (unless you were already on the last boss, in which case you have just enough time to run back and re-try him once).

I've had some runs with guildies that were super smooth and made the whole instance look easy, and I've had ones where my healer was constantly getting hit in the face by adds and we were falling behind on portals to the point that the next one was already opening just as we were engaging the current one. I also had one run which was super smooth until we popped a beacon on one of the portals which caused the tank to ignore the main mob (as it was being tanked by the summoned dragon), but then the beacon ran out before said mob was dead and it ran around killing half the group, nearly wiping us - just to illustrate my point about things being able to go south incredibly quickly. It's a weird dungeon, is what I'm saying.

Tempest Keep

The Mechanar

The Mechanar is another one of the heroics that's considered relatively easy and fast, though e.g. the fire lady can honestly be quite deadly! I guess the fact that the last boss drops a nice tanking sword adds to the appeal. Also, the robot guy is I think the only boss in all of BC's heroics that has completely different mechanics on heroic compared to normal (the Thaddeus-like charges vs. damage reflection shields on normal), which is quite peculiar now that I think about it.

The Botanica

The Botanica is a bit of an odd heroic in that most of it is not at all hard (with the exception of a few very disruptive trash mobs - but if you know what to look out for they are easy enough to handle), but quite long. At the same time though, it offers five badges for the effort, so the length is somewhat justified... I've found that people aren't overly fond of running this one normally, but when it's the daily there'll be a decent amount of groups, probably because a total of seven badges for an about hour-long run of an instance that isn't too challenging is not a bad payout.

The Arcatraz

The Arcatraz possibly rivals Shattered Halls in terms of unpopularity while still making people feel like they "have" to do it for the TK attunement chain/title. I do think that the difficulty is somewhat overrated though, because a lot of the trash consists of mobs that can be pulled as singles, meaning it's really not that challenging to handle. I'd say it's mostly the last boss that's rough, even if you're not worried about keeping Millhouse alive for the quest (but most of the time people do need that).

Beleaguered raid tank taking people through heroic Arca for their quest for the umpteenth time.

The biggest surprise to me here was the first boss, whom I remember doing an absolute ton of shadow damage, to the point that people recommended resist gear for him back in the day, yet he's never caused the groups I've been in any particular issues. This is an interesting contrast to the first boss of Mana Tombs, whom I don't remember being as bad as he is. I even have written evidence of that - I started this blog back in 2009, when Wrath of the Lich King was the current expansion, but BC was still in the fairly recent past back then, and one of my first posts was about rating the difficulty of BC heroic dungeon bosses.

In summary

I will say that Burning Crusade heroics are every bit as fun as I remember them being back in the day, and I plan to continue running them for as long as the expansion is around. I really love how much they defy brute force - though I'm not sure I want to say they are hard, exactly. Considering that I'm a woman rapidly approaching 40 who clicks most of her abilities, you don't really need to be a pro gamer to beat this content... but every boss and trash pull is a challenge that asks you to think about how to approach it, what to interrupt, what crowd control to use and when, and so on and so forth, and if you keep making bad decisions, there are consequences in the form of deaths and wipes.

Most importantly, everyone is part of that decision-making progress, and it really creates a feeling of working together. When I cast a heal at just the right time, when the tank taunts the mob just before it can hit me, when a rogue stuns the mob before it can fire off its most devastating ability, all of these things contribute to things coming together, and it just feels so good to me! Wrath of the Lich King felt very disappointing in comparison when everything descended into AoE fests where little seemed to matter other than running fast enough to keep up with your tank.

13 comments:

  1. Heroic Arc gets my vote for the most hated instance, even more than Blood Furnace, simply due to the difficulty at the end boss. I know people who finally got their quest done in there and flat out said "I am NOT going in here again!"

    And that first boss in H-Arc? I've never killed it. EVER. Got it down to 2% once, but that was it. Since it's optional, we just skip it.

    As for H-MT, I've never been in there, in spite of the fact that there's an Enhancement Totem that drops in there that's BiS at least through Phase Three. (At least I no longer need the Offhand weapon in H-AC.) I just really don't get on enough to drum up interest in running Heroic Mana Tombs (or running anything Heroic, or even doing any dailies, to be honest) as this is part of my way of coping with my mental aftermath of Phase 1. I'm just happy to stay relatively under the radar and not attract much attention as much as I can. If I am on these days and it's not raid time, I'm more often found on Neve, leveling her at a leisurely pace and completely out of sight from just about everybody save for my questing buddy.

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    1. I wonder if I just got really lucky with my heroic Arca runs? But at least one of them was a pug, and we still one-shot the first boss both times, seemingly without any issues. ^^'

      And yeah, when we got the first boss in heroic MT down at last, he did drop that totem, and we were all like: "That looks pretty BiS for enhancement... typical that this drops with no shaman in the group!"

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    2. Oh yeah, it's surprising that it's a blue, because it's pretty OP. And I know another Enhancement Shaman who has been gunning for that for months.

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  2. It's fun to read about your experiences in the Heroics vs my memories of how they went for me. Not that my memories are particularly reliable, but my remembered impressions would have had the rankings and difficulties fairly different.

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    1. Oh? Care to share some of those memories anyway? :)

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  3. I’m going to list my memories using your list so that it will make it easier to match things up. I mostly ran these on my hunter and my holy priest. I did some tanking on my druid, but that was usually when someone was desperate for a tank and contacted me. ^_^

    Ramps (as we called it) was common heroic echoing what you said about it being quick and easy.
    Blood Furnace was rarely run, to the point many people didn’t remember how to find the entrance. What I remember most is folks forgetting to move and letting mines blow them up.
    Shattered Halls was always a pain as everyone hated the gauntlet. It wasn’t until late in BC before people wanted just a paladin tank, so I did a lot of runs with warrior tanks. Doing a Champion of the Naaru run was especially nerve-wracking as a wipe always seemed to threaten to snowball into blowing the run. I will say, getting keyed by kill the Fel Reaver tended to be a high point in that quest chain. There was always someone who wanted payback. 😊I also remember enchanters asking to come back to farm the ‘gladiators’ for an enchant.
    Slave Pens was another quick and easy one. Though if someone missed interrupting a Coilfang Ray things could get ugly really fast. (I was very sad when they changed Fear Ward to only be on one person at a time. I had specific rolled a Draenei originally to be able to spread the Fear Ward love all around. Slave Pens was annoying when a couple of people wanted to try to do a skip on the bridge. I always had problems getting that skip down. It was usually quicker just to do the normal path.
    Underbog was seldom run unless someone needed something from there. People hated it because there always seemed to be way too much trash for the rewards. (Reading Xelnath’s postmorten on Underbog I cringe at how much he put in when he first worked on it. https://xelnath.com/2014/06/15/postmortem-3-the-underbog-spawning-my-first-dungeon/)
    Steamvaults was a favorite. It was quick, had some nice drops and doing the one quest bit was simple enough.
    Mana Tombs. Not many did that, but I never remember having any problem doing the first boss or anyone needing shadow resistance gear. Once in a while someone would die because they forgot the damage reflect, but other than that folks basically moved through it smoothly. It makes me wonder if modern players are overthinking some of these bosses. (We did generally pull the guys who feared back so that any mistakes weren’t lethal.) We rarely did the bonus boss because so few bothered to do the work into unlocking its key.

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    1. Auchenai Crypts was fun, especially if you got someone blown off the bridge by the ghosts. 😉 The extra boss could be a bit of gravy depending on his drops. The Naaru appearing was always confusing until you did the Horde-side quests.

      Sethekk Halls was always “who is going to get knocked into trash by the birds”? Once Anzu was available as a mount, it was much more popular as a run. It became the Druid Dungeon, though I never saw anyone on my then server with the mount until after BC. (I never saw anyone with the Winterspring Frostsaber, either until very late BC.)

      Shadow Labs. Oh god, those six and seven mob pulls before the second boss. That’s where you could tell if your group had it together. That said, a good Survival Hunter made life so easy there. (I was BM.) I remember spending 6+ hours in there trying to get a guildie to the quest bit for her Champion of the Naaru title. I also remember never, ever seeing the Sonic Spear drop for my Hunter. I so wanted that weapon for her. I never got it until sometime after transmog was introduced with Dragon Soul.

      Old Hillsbad Foothills. “Thrall! Buy a goddamn epic mount, you slow-ass orc!” I mostly remember all of my groups clearing Tarren Mill first, before we went to get Thrall. After that it wasn’t too bad if your group was using to being smart about small breaks in combat. I don’t remember losing tanks on the last boss. I’m sure it happened, but I don’t remember anyone avoiding it because of that. (I also remember once the hat quest was added we’d go farm that NPC for people.)

      The Black Morass was fun. My goal as a hunter was to keep Medivh’s bubble at 100% until the last boss spawned. I was generally able to do that. We kept the chrono-beacons for the last set of mini-bosses, so that things were easier. Things could get tedious with some of the runs between portals, but for the most part it was enjoyable.

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    2. Mechanar was the goto dungeon for quick badges. The only difficult boss was the fire lady as her elementals could wreck someone if they weren’t paying attention. Other than an accidental triggering of the gauntlet spawns, Mechanar always felt straightforward.

      Botanica was just long. Unless someone needed a chunk of badges people didn’t want to run it because of the perception of being long and tedious.

      Arcatraz could so easily be painful. From the boss abilities (don’t miss that interrupt on Dalliah) to the various mob abilities (the elementals in the quest item room and the demons in the room after that), Arc could be hell with an uncoordinated group. I do remember people skipping Zereketh most of the time. Skyriss wasn’t too bad after people realized they could skull the original. Keeping Millhouse alive could be touch and go if the tank wasn’t quick on the taunt.

      Once badges became a thing, unless you were doing a raid quest chain, most people just did the daily dungeon and farmed Kara instead for other badges.

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    3. To be honest I think most of that doesn't sound too different from my own assessments.

      You bringing up that enchant from Shattered Halls made me look it up and apparently my mage already has it! I didn't even remember getting it...

      I also don't remember ever doing that bridge skip in Slave Pens back in the day, though it might have been a thing at some point. I've done it a couple of times in Classic but I'm not good at it so I prefer to go the "normal" way with my groups as well, especially as it only really saves you from having to kill a couple of mobs anyway.

      And thanks for that link to Xelnath's blog; I'd never seen it before! That was a proper rabbit hole to fall down...

      I do suspect that heroics will become less interesting to people once badges become available from raids, but I assume that just like now there'll still be those who continue running them for reputation and fun.

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    4. You're right. Once I got to writing, most of it did seem the same. I think it was a few of the points that stood out as being quite different (1st boss Mana Tombs, last boss Old Hillsbrad, mainly).

      That bridge skip is where I started to realize that people will spend more time and effort to skip things than the time it would to actually just do the normal path. All for the sake of perceive "efficiency".

      You're welcome on Xelnath's blog. I love reading histories like that, especially since he's willing to show all the warts in order to have a teaching moment. I like having that little bit more of game development knowledge.

      It may be nostalgia, but I do like the original BC heroics. Maybe not the instances so much, but the environment of how groups approached them. When using all your abilities was encouraged and appreciated by the people you were playing with. While Wrath and later's "do a dungeon on your 1/2 hour lunch break" has it's appeal, that mentality just isn't my thing any more.

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  4. Oops, I hit Publish too fast on that first one. My fault on not putting in some separator lines. Sorry for the wall-o-text.

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  5. I've pretty much given up on heroics at this stage of BC. They definitely aren't the same, enjoyable memories I have of the original. Mainly because of the outright disrespect for CC. The current retail mentality (rightly so, there's no need) of 'CC? What's the point?' just doesn't sit well at all for me.

    For me the current experience has been all about how much damage you can output before shit hits the fan because the tank takes too much damage, or a mob leaks and nails the healer. It's compounded by mages and warlocks going apeshit too early and being one-shot for either not giving the tank enough time to aggro, or outright being on the wrong mob. Marks? Good luck seeing a tank who will throw up a skull before a pull.

    This was with both guildies and pugs, enough to the point that I just said screwit and moved on to more fun things in the game. I replaced a DPS with my hunter on a guild run into heroic OHB early on in the Heroics. Thrall's escape they'd wiped on four times. These are decently geared players, everyone on their game...except they refused to use CC. After the 2nd wipe after my entry I had to use my grumpy old man voice and basically bully them into using CC. We had a mage, a hunter, and a warlock. Once we started CC'ing 2 mobs, it became an absolute cakewalk.


    It's not that they're 'too hard', it's that there's no going back, the mentality of the playerbase has completely changed. DPS numbers are more important than DPS skills. I guess you just can't go home again.

    Bill

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    1. I've definitely met a couple of people like that, but at the same time it's not universal. I couldn't tell you how widespread it is on my server as I haven't pugged many heroics, but even in normals I've found people to generally be respectful of CC. Sure, there are definitely those who just want to AoE everything, but only mages and warlocks really have that spammable AoE anyway, and tanks are still rare enough that most dpsers have better sense than to annoy theirs just for wanting to go a bit more slowly and safely.

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