16/09/2024

I Dislike Delves but Not for the Reasons I Expected

So, hey! My first negative post about The War Within! Like I said, the bad things always take a bit of time to come out. To be clear, I'm still enjoying the expansion overall, but this post is about the one major gripe I have with it so far.

Delves were actually on my list of TWW features I was concerned about, but those original concerns could basically be summed up as me expecting delves to be boring and inconsequential, which is how I felt about Mist of Pandaria's scenarios.

As far as the inconsequential part goes, delves have actually been the opposite: This past week they have been the best way to get gear, giving higher item rating than was even possible to acquire in dungeons or raiding, meaning they were the "meta" thing to do. As I was already feeling only lukewarm about delves at this point, being made to feel like I "should" be doing them to gear up didn't endear me to them any further. But let's start at the beginning.

A bountiful delve icon but instead of a friendly golden glow inside, it contains the Eye of Sauron
I did my first few delves duoing with my husband, and my first impression was actually that they were pretty alright. Unlike scenarios, they didn't throw you into the middle of some ongoing story or overwhelm you with gimmicky mechanics. Earthcrawl Mines, the first delve and the one you get led into as part of the story, was a pretty straightforward little mini-dungeon in the sense that you go into a hole in the ground and clear out some baddies. There were some unique mechanics like the sticky spider webs, but it wasn't too much. I actually enjoyed that it seemed to reward slow and thorough exploration over speed-running, as there were little treasures to be found in every corner.

As we continued to explore different delves, the gimmicks started to ramp up a bit, like the candle circle that shrinks with each step you take. Having the husband yell at me to stand still with the candle while he pulled all the mobs was a bit less fun (thankfully the devs added a "drop candle" button later so I could do that and move too). Then we found that there were delves that were underwater, with constant fear of drowning. Ugh! There are air bubbles you can run through but they are finicky in their respawns and positioning. We had more than one death from drowning or falling off a cliff when trying to pick up a bubble close to an edge. (Why do you die from "falling off a cliff" in an underwater setting anyway?!) These definitely feel like something you shouldn't even attempt without a warlock or underwater breathing potions.

I also kept being a bit baffled by the delves' length, as Blizzard had been promoting them as something quick to do when you only have fifteen minutes, but I don't think we ever managed to do a delve in less than half an hour. They looked shorter than a dungeon based on the map, but every mob was a massive hitpoint sponge that took forever to die, which made things quite tedious gameplay-wise.

At one point the husband and I were about to do Waterworks together when he suddenly felt a bit unwell and wanted to lie down for a bit. I thought I'd give soloing it a try, as we were only on tier four and my item level was way, way higher than the recommended one already, so I figured I was going to be okay even as a healer.

My preservation evoker ended up being absolutely destroyed by the very first mob. I immediately decided that this clearly wasn't going to be worth my time and left again.

On reading around a bit, scaling for different specs, classes and group sizes has apparently been all over the place, and Blizzard has been applying hotfixes pretty much daily that could vastly change your experience even on the same character from one run to the next.

So you simultaneously have people talking both about how delves are a big cakewalk and should really be made a bit harder considering the high-level loot they give, and people saying that the bosses they're encountering are numerically impossible to beat even on lower difficulties. And both groups may be telling the truth, because depending on your class and spec, both of these scenarios, plus a number of ones in-between are all possible.

However, because you don't really know what others are experiencing, people just end up resenting each other over the whole thing, because if they are having an easy time, they think that WoW is full of bad players who are entitled and want loot for nothing, and if they are having a hard time, it's no fun to listen to others humble-brag about their easily earned loot showers while you're being told that you just need to learn to play.

Oh, and I haven't even talked about Brann yet! Brann Bronzebeard is your companion in this first season of delves and just... bloody hell. It's funny to me that Blizzard made such an effort to turn Magni back into a more serious character after how much of a meme he had become in BfA with his constant yells about the wounds of Azeroth, and then they went ahead and turned his brother into an even worse meme. He's just an absolute ball of chaos, firing off random abilities accompanied by voice lines non-stop. It's honestly pretty funny at first, but gets kind of annoying quickly. (I'm not surprised that there's already an addon to mute him.)

I've heard people complain about companion pathing in SWTOR on occasion, but after seeing Brann in action, I feel the SWTOR devs deserve more mad props than ever, considering how much our dwarven friend just leaps and teleports all over the place. "Where is Brann now?" is a question you'll find yourself asking often.

Oh, and unlike SWTOR companions, Brann can only be set to dps or heal, not tank, and his performance in either role also seems completely random, just to add to the pile of massive imbalances already described above. I've heard both reports of him being supposedly absolutely godly, making you unkillable while he's healing, or basically soloing the entire delve for you while dpsing, while others say that he's utterly useless, doing virtually no dps or healing, and that he just dies at the drop of a hat.

So ultimately, what we're left with is a mini-dungeon that somehow takes longer than a regular dungeon, with gimmicky mechanics that are sometimes fun and sometimes annoying. Promoted as TWW's new solo progression path, it can technically be soloed, but you gotta be the right class and spec. Healers (which is what I still main at the moment, but more on that another time) seem to be having a particularly terrible time, what a surprise. I actually think an argument could've been made for this kind of content simply not being designed with solo healers in mind, but apparently Torghast was perfectly fine to do as a solo healer during Shadowlands (I didn't try that myself) so I'm not sure why it's suddenly a problem.

I guess you can always go in with a group, but another thing I haven't mentioned yet is that there's a death counter as well, and if there are too many deaths during the run you lose the big prize at the end of the delve. Just to make sure healers don't have too much fun while doing these in a group either I guess.

It's just an all-around unappealing situation from my point of view, to be pushed into content that seems broken and un-fun in so many ways. I can only hope that Blizzard will eventually achieve some kind of balance for delves, or more importantly that they will lose relevance as the gear rating from other game modes ramps up. I feel like I'm clearly not the target audience for these so having them be the most optimal way to gear up right now is just not something I like.

11 comments:

  1. I think Delves work as you expect if you do them 1 or 2 levels lower than you can. For example I can do 8, but I die a lot, and over all success is uncertain. 7s are more certain but I still die if I don't take care. But I can fly through 6, which is the less than 15 min, casual content which was advertised. But that gives worse gear, so people are compelled to push as high as they can.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Are you doing them as ret, holy or prot? Because for me they've felt slow no matter the level.

      Delete
    2. Ret with Brann healing. I tried one as Holy, but since Brann can't hold threat, it was more annoying than anything.

      Delete
  2. These definitely feel like something you shouldn't even attempt without a warlock or underwater breathing potions.

    Hmm... Does Hydrocane still exist? I was just thinking that this is the easiest answer to the threat of drowning.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I wasn't sure whether that one survived the Cataclysm but Wowhead comments seem to imply that it's still around. Maybe I should go farm one up!

      Delete
  3. The thing that absolutely drives me crazy about whacky tuning situations is the lack of empathy people have for people who are just being mullered for no fault of their own.

    "It's alright for me."

    I know there's always an element of "get good" in every single aspect of a game with even a semblance of competitiveness, but dying to mobs just because they give you zero opportunity to prepare or defend yourself just isn't right.

    Mace and I were discussing the tuning last night and his response was along the lines of them being "too easy" and that they aren't hitting hard enough. Having been doing them as a guardian druid. Erm...

    Anyway.

    On the subject of Brann, I found myself extremely disheartened when I first loaded in and found he could only be DPS or healer. I do sorta get it, as making him tank means he'd need to be balanced around classes not having a heal for him as unlike with DPS you wouldn't be trying to "kill things before they kill you" ASAP. Just seeing those two roles was the first step in me realising this wouldn't be the alt-activity I hoped it would be. I'm sure my pally and DH will be fine, but my poor evoker... I suspect not.

    I am happy to have a sizable piece of solo-friendly content I can get involved with, but I definitely feel they need another pass in the near future to make them more approachable, especially for larger groups. Five lives is a lot for one person. It's a single wipe for a group. That's definitely in need of another look.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Delves are ... something. There are so many hotfixes and changes that it is hard to decide what to think about them in a concrete manner. The idea, in abstract, sounds good, but I think Blizzard has too many hands touching them. Are they mainly hard group content or mainly for solo players? It seems like they float both directions and that's not good for figuring out if you want to do them. The way it is going I wouldn't be surprised if they don't reappear after this expansion.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It does feel a bit like they're not entirely sure what they want delves to be. How viable should they be in groups? Just how hard should they be in general? I've seen people make comparisons to the Mage Tower from Legion, but my impression was that this was a thing you did once for bragging rights, not something you were meant to do every week for gear.

      Delete
    2. Yah, the Mage Tower was for the unique artifact weapon skins. They were difficult, but far better tuned for each spec. This isn't to say the Mage Tower instances didn't have problems as some of the challenges could be cheesed (the Twins, the one technically on the Broken Isles) and others really needed a specific set of the RNG Legion legendaries, but for the most part if you played your class reasonably well you could do the challenges. Unlike Delves which seem to just go for high-damage/insta-kill damage sponges. :/

      Even with five people close to the ilevel of suggested gear you can still easily fail. The candle mechanic (move and shrink the circle of life) seems especially punishing in a group. :/

      Delete
  5. I do delves as a discipline priest, and have Brann as dps, you got to give him the correct abilities too, or he will make a mess, but with the right ones that work to your class and spec, he is absolutely amazing, he already has gone through fixes, and you have to be aware, his "punch" lines are actually helpful, I don't know why people would mute him, but he actually warns you for when you would be getting a huge dmg, and then with the right abilities he throws you a shield, or as healer he throws you healing flasks. Even as a dps, if he sees you getting low, he runs to you and bandage you, and then sets up a campfire so you can eat and that heals for a huge amount of hp per tick.

    So, honestly, I do not get the complaints about him being annoying, he's really useful, and a tip, when you're night elf, you seriously can use Shadowmeld, and he will get all the agroo and kill all the mobs for you.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I mean, I'm sure that some issues can be improved by things like skill selection for Brann etc. but when some classes/specs are breezing through with seemingly no effort it's still a cold comfort to tell people that are struggling that "if you work ten times harder you can do it too".

      And I'm glad you like Brann, but not getting the complaints about him being annoying at all surprises me. His movement can be extremely erratic and he loves to tell you that you shouldn't stand in stuff, just to then stand in it himself. Plus, even if he was 100% helpful, the sheer frequency with which he repeats the same voice lines can already get tiresome, and that's saying something when the expansion has been out for less than a month!

      Delete